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DECEMBER'S Book Choice: The Boy in Striped Pyjamas
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On a scale of 1-5 stars, how do you rate The Boy in Striped Pyjamas?
*
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
**
10%
 10%  [ 2 ]
***
10%
 10%  [ 2 ]
****
15%
 15%  [ 3 ]
*****
55%
 55%  [ 11 ]
Didn't finish it
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Didn't read this one
10%
 10%  [ 2 ]
Total Votes : 20

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Tigerlily
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 12:12 pm    Post subject: DECEMBER'S Book Choice: The Boy in Striped Pyjamas Reply with quote

Discuss your thoughts on the book here as soon as you have finished reading it. Did you (not) enjoy it? Anything that struck you or maybe someone else can answer if you have a question? We're not really looking for in depth discussions...just tell us what you think of it!

For those who have finished it, please choose a star rating for the book based on how much you liked it. What did you think of it? Do you have any questions based on the book?

If you do have something to post that reveals plot details which could ruin others' enjoyment of the book, please use the spoiler function (details: http://onlinebookclub.myfreeforum.org/about12.html)



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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I read this some time ago and loved it.  I had no preconceptions about it, I had no idea what the story was about so was fairly surprised by the content.

Wonderfully written, very moving and had me in tears by the end.  I remember that there was quite a debate on RISI regarding this book; whether it was 'true to life', and if the circumstances told in the story would have really happened.  Well, that just doesnt matter to me, I think the whole point of the story is to look at prejudices and the innocence and non judgemental ways of children.

One of my favourite reads of the year I think.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I joined in the RISI discussion and can't remember exactly what I said but I did find significant bits of it implausible.

Spoiler:

I couldn't believe the boy would have no idea of the ideals of the Nazis. I also felt that given where they were living, the boys whereabouts would probably be monitored more closely, ie he'd not have been able to spend so much time with the boy in the camp without anyone's knowledge.



But I guess a clever tale in its own way.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really enjoyed this book

Spoiler:

I thought it was very moving, and I think it highlighted the innocent viewpoint of children during this time. The form of the novel, like a children's story, also emphasised this theme of innocence.

I have also heard some criticism of the book. For example, 'how could Bruno have not understood what was going on?' and 'no-one will criticise a book which has the holocaust as its subject matter'. I disagree with both these points, I work with young people and it is surprising how unaware of their circumstances they are - they have not yet formed a 'world view' and really only know about themselves and their lives in a very blinkered way.

Another critisism that I agree with to some extent is that there are still several holocaust survivors living in extreme poverty, yet authors and film-makers are making money from their suffering. I don't know any facts and figures regarding this, but it does seem pretty unfair.

If anyone is interested in reading another book that deals with the same theme, and in an unusual way try 'Time's Arrow' by Marin Amis.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Won't have a chance to read this as I will be reading Christmas Carol instead this month
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 11:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I read the boy in the Striped pyjamas a few months ago - I found it quite disappointing after reading quite a lot of hype.

I don't know how to do a spoiler so I'll just say I thought it was very naiive and the fact that a lot of the shock factor relied on the misinterpretation of words in English which wouldn't have the same impact in the language of the country the book was set in spoilt it for me.

Not one I'd recommend to people but it was a quick and easy read so I'd say if they fancy it, its no great hardship to spend a few hours reading it to judge for yourself.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I personally really enjoyed this book-I found it thought provoking and I liked the main characters.  It was a fairly quick read, and different to a lot of the usual books I would read, and for that reason I have been recommendnig it to people.

I am not sure the cover or the blurb would have drawn me in and made me pick up this book, it was a recommendation by Treez whcih made me desperate to read it!
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mcapindale
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This has been on my wishlist for absolutely ages, but I have never been able to get it in a swap.  I have used this as an excuse to buy myself a copy, and will be reading it very soon.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2007 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I read this very recently for my RL bookgroup, and have conflicting thoughts about it.

Firstly, about the target readership, I feel that as a book for young teens or as a crossover book the writing is immature. I think that is because of the age of the main character, and the events being seen through his eyes. I don't think that he is particularly naive for a nine year old at that time, but I would have thought that a young teen reading this would find the majority of the book rather juvenile. I thought that children preferred books with characters slightly older than themselves.

I found it really difficult to 'forget' things that I know and to see them through a child's eyes.  I'm sure that the use of 'Fury' and 'Out-With' works well for a non-German speaker, but like Beadyjan my reaction was -'he is speaking German, so there wouldn't be any similarities in the sounds of Führer and Wut', (the German for 'fury'). Ditto Out-With.

There were also several continuity, and other minor errors that bothered me, too, but mostly I was distracted by a fairly important feature of the plot; The fence. Firstly, there is no way that the bottom of the fence would not be fixed, and if there was a weak area, it is too coincidental to my adult mind that Bruno and Shmuel should meet just there. But mostly - this wouldn't have been a bit of chicken wire that could be lifted by a starving child, Auschwitz was surrounded by electrified barbed wire.

However, those considerations aside it is a powerful story, and I couldn't help but catch my breath when Bruno climbed under the fence. My imagination then ran ahead of the book to the obvious conclusion. Obvious to me, that is. I guess this is going to be one of those endings that a child will remember well into adult life.

I did like the way the final moments that Bruno and Shmuel had together were left entirely to the readers imagination, as also was the punishment Bruno saw meted out to Pavel by Lieutenant Kotler. It isn't commented on, but I don't think that Pavel appears in the book again, that must register in the young reader's mind.

*********************
I endorse Miranda's recommendation of Time's Arrow
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 2:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought that this was a brilliant book.  I liked the simplicity of it, as to me that emphasises how shocking the Holocaust was.  I don't think that Bruno was particularly niave for his age at that time.  I agree that some of it was implausible - they weren't missed all the times they met, and the gap in the fence, but this didn't disturb my enjoyment of the book.  It is a book that will stay with me, and one that I will encourage my son to read when he is older.

I, too, speak German and noticed that Bruno's confusion over words doesn't work in German, but I took the view that it needs to work in English, as it is written in English.

I would definately recommend this book.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2007 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I gave this 2 stars as I found it irritating and very disappointing given the reviews it has received. My thoughts on this are all muddled so this might not make sense. First of all

Spoiler:

I think that an adult reader with knowledge of Auschwitz would understand the ending better and therfore be more disturbed by it. Would younger teenagers know enough to really understand the horror of the holocaust as portrayed in this book???  I don't think the lack of blurb is a good idea as I think reading about this sort of thing should be a personal choice. I hope that any parent giving this to their child knows what its about. Maybe there's no blurb because it would put people off. Don't get me wrong, I love history and I think its important for children to learn what has happened in the world, I just didn't like this way of doing it.

I found the writing style annoying by the second page and the idea that Bruno (or Shmuel for that matter) would have no idea what Nazis were and why the Jews were being segregated is too much.
When the penny dropped as to what 'Out-With' was I did get a sense of dread for the rest of the book. And when he crawled under the fence I made the leap to what Auschwitz is known for. I was sort of praying that it wouldn't end the way I suspected.



Ultimately this is a tragic story highlighting the innocence of so many who died in that awful place. I honestly wish I could unread this, but maybe that's the point.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just going to spoiler the lot...

Spoiler:

I enjoyed this book, but would not say that it deserves all the hype surrounding it.  I had no problem with how naive the boys were, especially in Bruno's case, as I felt that his mother at least would have tried to shield him from what was happening in the world, and it probably is difficult for a 9 year old to understand war.  The main problem for me was that Bruno's mis-understand of certain words would not have worked in the language he would have been speaking in.  

I guessed that the book would not end happily, although I did not believe Bruno would die until he crawled under the fence - up until that point, I thought that Shmuel would just stop being at the fence for good one day and Bruno would come to realise what had happened.



I gave it three stars.
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amarie
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Finished this weeks ago, but have only now got around to posting. I thought it was fantastic & gave it 5 stars.

Spoiler:

I too loved the simplicity of the book & after reading The Historian by Elizabeth Kostova which took me forever to finish, this book was a delight. I didn't know what to expect & was dreading it a bit as I wanted to read something "lightweight" but once I started I couldn't put it down. I think the key to the novel for me anyway is that is described as a fable on the title page. Therefore I didn't take the language twists & naievety of Bruno to heart. I actually thought the use of Out-With & the Fury was a smart trick by the author. Admittedly I did think that a child of a senior Nazi officer would have been more indoctrinated into Nazi beliefs etc.. but he was only nine & again it is a fable so Bruno was supposed to be innocent & basically a blank canvas in that he had no preconceptions of Jewish people. I figured out early on how it would finish but I thought they would find his body & his father & others might then learn their lesson. I think the ending as it is is better. I was going to put it up for swaps but now thanks to Maureen's idea I'm going to keep it for my kids & hopefully they will read it when they are older. I think it is one of those must read books & would love to see it on the school syllabus. I wish I'd read books like this at school & if I had I'd never have forgotten it.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I definitely agree with you Amarie that it is a book that children should read and discuss at school. I borrowed my copy so will have to get hold of another when my kids are ready for it but I would certainly like them to try it. Perhaps I should start a list of books to recommend to my kids!!! (I'd certainly never remember otherwise!)
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PostPosted: Fri May 02, 2008 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I read this last week and would recommend it to children and adults alike.

Spoiler:

I found it a simple, yet tragic tale told from a child's perspective. I think if you try to go too indepth with a fable of this kind it begins to lose its meaning and intent. It certainly made an impact on me and I've passed it on to my Mum to read next. I've read a couple of books since and certain parts of this one keep coming back to my mind. I love thought provoking books and this one certainly fits the bill for me, I gave it 5 stars.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've just finished reading this book today and found it totally absorbing. I loved it, beautiful in it's simplicity and certainly one to linger in my memory.

Spoiler:


I enjoyed the style of writing and found it a compelling read. It certainly appeals to adults as much as children IMO. I know there has been some debate regarding the "out-with" and "The Fury"  play on words, and I do agree that this obviously doesn't translate into German when the book is set from a German speakers POV. However this didn't ruin anything for me. I guessed the play on "The Fury" quite quickly, but didn't get "out-with" until closer to the end when Gretal moans at Bruno for not pronouncing it correctly.

I liked the subtleties regarding Bruno's mother and Lieutenant Kotler.

I also liked Bruno's total naivity and thought it was plausible. He's only nine and his parents seem to have gone out of their way to not tell him where they are or what's going on. A nine year old boy probably had no interest in the news and didn't understand much about his father's role and clearly felt unable to ask any questions about it.

I didn't guess the ending at all and was totally shocked and horrified. Even when the people were rounded up and made to "march" I still kept thinking that a soldier would recognise Bruno and he'd get pulled out. I was actually pondering an ending where the family end up back in Berlin and he has to live his life with the knowledge of what had happened to his friend. That shows how off the mark I was!



I gave this book 5 stars and although it's my 1st read of 2009 I'm wondering if it's going to be my favourite for this year...?!
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 10:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

my thoughts are as follows.....

Spoiler:

I found the style very hard to read and didn't paticulary enjoy it right up until the end when i was blown away, moved to tears and just devastated by what i had just finished reading. I gave it 5 stars simply because it's ending did what it was intended to do- and that is to shock the reader and slam him face forward into a brick wall of harsh reality. it is one thing to read about this sort of thing but another to have it forced down your throat in such a fashion. some might not like this approach but if it can bring out strong emotion and make you stop for a moment and just think about what you have just read and the importance of the fact that this ( the holocaust) was a real event not just something in a book then the whole idea and motive behind the book works.

There are inconsistencies and they will nark some people. i did not think about the language differences i will admit but did think it was a bit too easy for bruno to cross the fence. But that said IT IS ONLY A NOVEL- A FABLE OR PARABLE NOT A RECREATION OF EVENTS THAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED! It is a symbol of those paticular times, a metaphor for what happened in Germany; a simplistic recreation of a time most people have tried to forget but whom should probably bot forget and the whole concept behind fiction after all is the suspension of disbelief!

I read a lot of sci-fi, horror and crime novels. much of what i read is impossible and couldn't happen but for those 500 + pages none of that matters and so a little leniency has to be allowed i feel for this book. it is not a true life account in the same way something like the book thief is not a true account but that is no less a book because it is not real!

This is one of several books i have read in the last twelve months that has had a serious affect on the boooks i have chosen to read in the future and though i didn't like the style of writing and did not want to keep the book in my house because its subject matter disturbed and upset me too much, it nonetheless rates for me alongside the kite runner, thousand splendid suns, sarah's key, wild swans , mao; not because it is as good as any of those titles but because it has caused me to examine the world at large more closely and because it has inspired me to read books i feel are important as well as just books i enjoy to read!

i will not watch the film because the last pages really really upset me- even thinking about it now upsets me- and i am not one normally to show emnotion in such a way. that this book can still makle me want to cry months after i read it, for me means it deserves the full rating even if i never want to read it again! This is as much because i feel i don't need to read it again as iot is about feeling so disturbed by what i read



i hope nobody is offended by what i have said- i am not criticising anyone elses point of view and think we are all entitled to our opinion but i do have strong views about this book and i am in no way slagging anybody who thought differently about their reading experience! the whole point about these discussions is that we all take away something differrent from what we read. but this is a book that has had a longlasting affect on me and will for years to come...i am not entirely sure why but can only put it down to the fact that i am alleged to have some jewish ancestry in my family past.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with you sparkymarky...

Spoiler:


The ending was a complete shocker to me, and I didn't know what to do with myself. Unfortunately I was cheekily reading it walking around the house with my boys about and playing. I was so close to the end I didn't want to put it down. Now I wish I had saved it until they were in bed. I was so shocked about the matter of fact way that Bruno was led to his death with the others that I felt my heart plunge to my stomach. I sat down reeling from the impact of what I'd just read to then have my 4 year old asking me to play. I almost didn't know how to respond to him for a few minutes.

I also now don't know what to do with the book. I don't know if I'll read it again, but to add it to my swaps list almost makes me feel that I don't care for the subject matter so I'm casting it aside. The book is sitting in my spare room waiting for me to make a decision on it.

Although I enjoyed the style of writing and didn't get annoyed with it at all, I agree that the 5 stars mark is mostly due to the ending.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2009 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I haven't read this yet but must read it now as I want to see what Sparky has put in his spoiler.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2009 11:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

heathera wrote:
I agree with you sparkymarky...

Spoiler:


The ending was a complete shocker to me, and I didn't know what to do with myself. Unfortunately I was cheekily reading it walking around the house with my boys about and playing. I was so close to the end I didn't want to put it down. Now I wish I had saved it until they were in bed. I was so shocked about the matter of fact way that Bruno was led to his death with the others that I felt my heart plunge to my stomach. I sat down reeling from the impact of what I'd just read to then have my 4 year old asking me to play. I almost didn't know how to respond to him for a few minutes.

I also now don't know what to do with the book. I don't know if I'll read it again, but to add it to my swaps list almost makes me feel that I don't care for the subject matter so I'm casting it aside. The book is sitting in my spare room waiting for me to make a decision on it.

Although I enjoyed the style of writing and didn't get annoyed with it at all, I agree that the 5 stars mark is mostly due to the ending.




i was sitting with vic while she was watching telly when I read the ending Heathera and I too didn't know what to do with myself either. for several moments i felt like i was going to break into tears and had to go upstairs to compose myself. i borrowed this from the library so keeping it wasn't an option anyway but if i had owned it, i think i would have just put this away somewhere also. i don't think i will ever, or need to, read this again but i would like emilie to read it when she is older as i would like her to have a better understanding of events such as this and the greater world at large. As an analaogy of what actually happened, i think this works very well and gives the reader a more personal feel of the sense of tragedy involved. The whole idea of fiction is that you believe in the characters and become intensely involved in their world and i think the way this book sucks you in means that it makes what happens next allthe more poignant and real to you the reader.

it is one thing to read about such things in history books etc but yet another to experience it and this is the closest many of us will ever come to actually experiencing the sense of horror that must have surrounded this time. the fact that it can have had such an impact on me emotionally, i think speaks volumes to the effect that this is a very powerful novel!


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