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Gone With the wind (READALONG 2009 ) currently chapters 6-9
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heathera
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spoiler:


As this was the only life the slaves knew I expect there was a loyalty to their families, and also that snobery that Mitchell protrays. Those poor white folk who couldn't afford any slaves are looked down on by the slaves of the rich people.

I suppose it depended how the slaves were treated as to the degree of their loyalty. As you've said, Blueflower, Ellen O'Hara appears to be an absolute saint. The slaves, at this point, seem happy to come to her when there's a sickness or birthing problem. Also as Gerald has been said to never whip his slaves, then I'm sure that also went in his favour.

I hadn't minded Gerald O'Hara at first, but as we found out a bit more of his background in chapter 3 I've found myself disliking him.

As for Scarlett, I think she seems to be a 16 year old of her time. Bound by the laws of courting as they were then. I've not disliked her at all, I'm interested to how she moves on. What'll happen the next time she sees Ashley now he's announcing his engagement to his cousin and not her???



I'm enjoying this book!
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm going to start on the next three chapter tonight, to try and really get into the story.
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes! My copy arrived today so will join in asap.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 25, 2009 10:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm really enjoying Gone With the Wind and finished Chapter 3 last night. The idea of the slaves being loyal to their owners to the point where they look down on 'white trash' who can't afford slaves is intriguing. I agree it does seem a bit too cosy, but maybe it was for some? I wonder if anyone's ever researched slavery from the slaves' perspective, to see if they were happy with their lot? Never thought of that before.
Spoiler:

I kind of feel Ellen isn't so different in a way. She doesn't come across as truly happy and I don't blame her! But it was her choice to marry Gerald in order to escape her family. She's not a happy bunny at all is she? Just accepts her lot. And did I read right that Gerald ran to America because he killed a man? He was a bit of a rascal wasn't he? I can't help but run the film in the back of my mind as I'm reading the book and love how all the juicy stuff the film, of course, doesn't depict, is all coming out in the book. I had no idea Gerald was such a scallywag and that Ellen wasn't really into him.  

I really like Scarlet's character so far and feel for her over Ashley, although she's attracted to him only because he's a challenge.

17 inch waist and big boobs, ay? Must've been malformed from the corsets they wore!


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 9:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Loving this book so much I'm up to chapter 7 already. Will hold on before I comment on chaps 4-6. Are we discussing those this week or next?
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

as soon as you are ready glynis
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ooh ok! What shall I do? Start a new thread or add to this one?
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

just add to this one, might as well- saves having loads of threads everywhere! Don't forget to spoiler though- some of us haven't even started chapter four yet-ahem!- mind have had an excuse as been too up and down to read at mo! will try n catch up on weds.....
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 10:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have read chapters 1-3, I actually remembered more of the book than I thought I would (I read more than half of it before I got pregnant with Zachary, and then I couldn't read a page, let alone a whole tome like GWTW!).  I loved chaters 1 and 2, not so keen on chapter 3, I guess because I am loving Scarlett and the focus isn't around her for chapter 3.  Plan to read 4-6 tonight!
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 11:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is everyone happy for me to start discussions for chapters 4-6 or should I hold on?

Kate, I know what you mean! I love Scarlett too and am glad the focus is now back on her.

(Ps also know what you mean trying to read whilst pregnant. It just doesn't happen does it? I read A Prayer for Owen Meany, or tried to, but when I started feeling queasy, every time I looked at the book it reminded me of feeling sick. Actually, even now, 5 years on, if I see the cover of the book, I still feel bleurgh and don't like to be reminded. It's the same with the perfume I was wearing at the time - I can't smell it now without feeling ugh. Amazing how rough I felt for 2 weeks. Didn't eat a thing, just crackers and plain biscuits. It was a real struggle, but in a nice way!!!).
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 12:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Discuss away Glynis!!!
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heathera
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think I might be a bit ahead of myself as I finished chapter 9 yesterday.... I've gotten so engrossed in it! I'm thoroughly enjoying the story line. I love the scene setting by Margaret Mitchell, I can really picture what is must have been like living in that time.

Spoiler:


I do really like Scarlett but I think she is a little big headed. She obviously feels that Ashley will drop his engagement to Melanie at her whim. She doesn't expect her love to be unrequited. Does she really love Ashley though? She's only 16 years old and she hasn't spent any time with him other than talking at Tara or at social gatherings. I suppose this was the only way to get married at the time and you only really got to know your husband once you were married.

The fact that she marries Charlie when she doesn't get her own way with Ashley is ludicrous. She behaves in a spoilt and petulant manner and ends up having to live with the consequences for the rest of her life. It's a shame that she becomes a widow and a mother straight away and I do feel for her. She obviously suffers from undiagnosed Postnatal Depression. However the constraints on her as a widow are shocking. As a reader I was partly feeling that she did bring this onto herself so she has to bear the consequences of her mis-guided actions. However on the other hand I feel sorry for her, being a single mother at 17, not allowed to talk or dance with anyone, not allowed to go out and having to wear traditional mourning clothes for what appears to be the rest of her life. It's a tough outcome for Scarlett.



I haven't got my book in front of me, but I'm sure my next comments cover chapters 6-9 so I'll spoiler them seperately from above.

Spoiler:


I'm loving Rhett Butler! I've got this devilish, handsome man in my head when I imagine him. I like the fact that he's attracted to Scarlett's spirit and actually is interested in a woman who is more than just pleasing on the eye with nothing between her ears. The fact that Scarlett risks her reputation to dance with Rhett at the charity event is great! I'm sure she'll have to pay for that over the forthcoming chapters, but I was so pleased to see her striking out against the grain of what society dictates to her. I think Rhett will be good for her, although I'm sure Aunt Pittypat, Melanie, her mother etc etc won't agree!



A fabulous book, I can't wait to read the next 3 chapters.

Discuss away Glynis, what do you think?
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My thoughts on chapters 4-6:

Spoiler:

I loved the introduction of Rhett Butler - the anti-hero, outsider, dangerous, handsome, experienced...Having read this I can see how Clark Gable was perfect for the role. I can't help but picture Vivien Leigh as Scarlett and CG as Rhett.

I got thinking about how pale skin was the fashion and wonder if it was to separate the well off white people from the black people. It would also have shown that they did not have to work in the fields. I imagine pale skin was also ladylike. Tell you what, I couldn't be doing with the tight lacing on Scarlett's corset/stays. It made me wince reading about her struggling to move about. I know in times of war well off women wore corsets to make them feel secure, but the corsets were so restrictive - undoubtedly to ensure women behaved in a ladylike manner. It definitely goes against Scarlett's character to be so restricted. She's not a woman of her time, I guess, in that she doesn't always want to act in a prescribed manner. I like that about her - her free spirit and wonder if and how it'll change throughout the course of the novel.

I can't believe she's decided to marry Charles! She's so young, I wish someone would tell her she'll get over Ashley and meet someone else. But I'm talking from a 21st century perspective!!  I don't think she really loves Ashley - she just likes the challenge of him. It's almost as if she needs to prove to herself that any man will want her, including any reluctant ones. You always want what you can't have, and often when you finally get it, you realise you don't really want it after all. Who knows? Maybe we'll find out if she still thinks of Ashley as the novel goes on.

That's about it really. I like how Rhett contrasts with the other male characters. Exotic.



I'm so pleased I can now go on and read the next 3 chapters. Loving this book!
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just finished chapter 9. I can't get enough of this book. Don't know if I'd have ever read it if it weren't for the readalong.

Spoiler:

What a brilliant ending to these 3 chapters (6-9). I really felt for Scarlett being so socially restricted at 17 and loved her getting up to dance with Rhett. I didn't realise how restrictive being a widow was. The thought of being in mourning for so long, especially for a 17 year old girl. I could feel Scarlett's frustrations, but I felt for Melly donating her wedding ring.

What a rogue Rhett is. I like him being compared to a pirate - very fitting. Especially him flitting off in his boat to do business on the qt with the Yankees.

It's made me want to look into the history of American Civil War. Something I don't know a great deal about. Actually, here's a bit about it that may help put the story into context for anyone who, like me, isn't au fait with the details!

Quote:
The civil war between North and South was caused by two major issues - slavery and states' rights. The southern states, where slavery was legal, wanted to take slavery into the western territories. Northerners wanted to stop the spread of slavery. Southerners also objected to interference by the central government and wanted to be able to reject any federal law they did not like.

In 1860 Abraham Lincoln was elected President. Lincoln was opposed to the spread of slavery, and the South feared he would abolish it altogether. The southern states left the Union, claiming they had a legal right to do so, and called themselves the Confederate States of America.

When the southern states left the Union, they seized all federal property such as forts and government buildings. In December 1869, the commander of a fort at Charleston, South Carolina, refused to surrender. He moved his troops to Fort Sumter on an island in Charleston's harbour where the Union forces held out against the Confederates. In April 1861, Lincoln sent supply ships to Fort Sumter. Just before the ships arrived, the Confederates fired on the fort and forced a surrender. The American Civil War had begun.

The Civil War was the scene of the first battle ever fought between ironclad ships. At the beginning of the war the North placed a naval blockade around the South to prevent the Confederacy from trading with other nations. The Confederates, who had no navy, got hold of an old Union ship, the Merrimack, covered it with iron plates and fitted it with ten guns. An ironclad ship could easily destroy a wooden ship. When the North learned of the Merrimack's transformation, they built their own iron ship, the Monitor. It carried only two guns but it had a revolving turret so the guns could fire in any direction. This strange-looking ship was described as a 'cheesebox on a raft'.

On 8th March 1862, the Merrimack attacked and sank the 50-gun USS Cumberland. That night the Monitor arrived on the scene. It met the Merrimack and for four and a half hours the two vessels fired round after round at each other. Neither ship won the battle, and the blockade was to remain in effect throughout the war. But naval history had been made. (From: A History of the United States of America Through Art by Eleanor Van Zandt).


I love the phrase - God's nightgown!

Plus don't you think it amazing how long people stayed at one another's homes?


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 1:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spoiler:

I'm wondering if Rhett will be good for Scarlett too (just re-read your post Heather). I can't help but feel he's a bad influence, even though they're like minded, free-spirited souls. I have a feeling he'll be good for her mental and emotional wellbeing, but definitely not for her reputation of course,  but I think she's reaching boiling point being so restricted that I reckon she'd strike out Rhett or no Rhett at some point. I have a feeling he won't be good for her in the long run - he's like a cowboy - doesn't stay put for long, an outcast etc. I can't remember what happened in the film so will have to read on to see how his relationship with Scarlett develops


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glynis about your post.

Spoiler:

I just read your post about Scarlett been only 16 when she married - but that was old compared to her mother who was 15 when she married the much older Gerald.  And India was considered an old maid as she was unmarried at 20!  What gets me is the fact that all these middle age men are chasing the very young girls.  Isn't Scarlet's younger sister considering a balding man of 35ish! It just all a bit gross!  

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

blueflower wrote:
Glynis about your post.

Spoiler:

I just read your post about Scarlett been only 16 when she married - but that was old compared to her mother who was 15 when she married the much older Gerald.  And India was considered an old maid as she was unmarried at 20!  What gets me is the fact that all these middle age men are chasing the very young girls. Isn't Scarlet's younger sister considering a balding man of 35ish! It just all a bit gross!  



Yes, Mr Kennedy? That's like me chasing a 15 year old boy. Yuk!
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glynis wrote:
blueflower wrote:
Glynis about your post.

Spoiler:

I just read your post about Scarlett been only 16 when she married - but that was old compared to her mother who was 15 when she married the much older Gerald.  And India was considered an old maid as she was unmarried at 20!  What gets me is the fact that all these middle age men are chasing the very young girls. Isn't Scarlet's younger sister considering a balding man of 35ish! It just all a bit gross!  



Yes, Mr Kennedy? That's like me chasing a 15 year old boy. Yuk!


Shades of 'Notes of a Scandal'!
Yes, it was Mr Kennedy.

Spoiler:

 I still find the way the slaves are treated as very strange to what we are usually lead to believe. At the barbecue the slaves had there own and black and white children running around the lawns together!
Must try to get some.



Here is a tasty recipe for those pigs intestines you didn't know what to do with.  They are supposed to taste just like ham.

CHITTERLINGS/CHITLINS RECIPE
Chitlins take a lot of time and effort to clean. They are partially cleaned when they are sold, but require additional hand cleaning before they are ready to eat. The secret to good and safe chitlins is in the cleaning, not in the cooking. When buying chitterlings, be prepared to buy 10 pounds of chitlins to get 5 pounds to cook.

INGREDIENTS:
10-pound bucket fresh or frozen chitterlings
Cold water to cover
1 cup cider vinegar
5 bay leaves
2 large onions, coarsely chopped
2 large potatoes, peeled and coarsely chopped
1 green or red bell pepper, cored, seeded, and coarsely chopped
3 cloves garlic, minced
Salt and freshly ground black pepper to taste
Hot pepper sauce
PREPARATION:
If chitterlings are frozen, thaw. Using a small soft brush, clean chitterlings thoroughly; rinse in several changes of cold water. Cut into 1 1/2 to 2-inch pieces. Place the cleaned chitterlings into a large pot; cover with water and vinegar. Add bay leaves, onions, potatoes, green or red pepper, garlic, salt, and pepper. Bring to a boil; turn heat to low and simmer for 2 1/2 to 3 hours or until chitterlings are tender. remove from heat; drain well. Serve with your favorite hot pepper sauce.
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katey
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 22, 2009 3:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I read 6-9 yesterday, really enjoyed them.  Glynis, the bits that you mentioned are also teh bits that had the most impact on me.  How different times are now!



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